military sexual trauma

[2eclipse]

lots of people feel that women should be drafted equally with men.
in some ways i see the fairness of this. of course i am against any draft at all or any war at all for that matter. but i am back-listening to NOW podcasts and i recently listened to the episode about sexual assault in the military and it has changed my mind.
some interesting facts gleaned from the episode:
- after the first gulf war 15 % of women reported being raped in a government study.
- close to 25% reported being sexually assaulted, which lead to committess being established and a lot of rules and policies that apparantly are not enforced at all. One of the things that happened is a process were women can report in a limited capacity, get the help they need, but not initiate investigations and hearings. since then, the number of women reporting sexual assault and seeking treatment has DOUBLED!
- women who report rape or assault are often tormented by the people who are supposed to be helping them as well as people completely uninvolved.
- a low priority is put on keeping women safe. restrictions are placed on perpetrators, but are not enforced.

in my opinion it is a travesty that we are so failing the people who have stepped forward to help. how dare we even think of putting a draft on women when we can't/don't protect them from the other soldiers!
i also have some problems with the program for not addressing male rape. if it is happening with women, odds are it is happening with men too. i would like to know more about that side of things.

Comments

[keisolo.livejournal.com]

It's a really screwed up issue, that one. As far as rights and privelages and responsibilities are concerned, it should be equal. However, the issues you put forth here are more prevalent than any study indicates, and with the dropping of the bar for WHO can join the military (the laxing of mental stability standards leaps to mind) - it can only get worse.
As far as the male rape concept goes, it would be near impossible to find out what and how much and where that happens, and to what extent, as the military possibility on homosexuality is so bloody ridiculous to begin with.

[2eclipse.livejournal.com]

i'm all about equality...but i'm also a pacifist, so i don't think the draft should exist for men or women. if it has to exist, i want it to exist for as few people as possible.
that being said the idea of women forced into a situation that is unsafe for them is infuriating to me. the idea of the government getting away with it is worse. it pushes me into irrational anger(clearly a personal problem).
i agree that it would be impossible to get any accurate figures on gay rape in the military, but it should be possible to find some INaccurate figures from the few who have come forward and raise some sympathy for them.

[keisolo.livejournal.com]

Oh, it irritates the ever-living hell out of me, too.
And I may not be a pacifist, exactly, since my cynicism regarding humanity is tempered, but still fairly boundless - I would definitely prefer for the world and this country to be in a framework and circumstance where such things could be for the few - or even for the none.
Irrational, to one extent or another, anger at such a circumstance, especially when it is the government (wasn't there something about "for the people" written once?) is not an unexpected or unwarranted reaction. It is ridiculous. It is sickening. And it is one of a long list of things that fall into those two categories.
However, rape is a loss of autonomy. It is a degradation of self. And no matter how well you cope with it initially or as time wears on, there is near always the thought that you should have been able to damned well prevent it. It doesn't matter how massively they out-massed you, out-strengthed you... I've even met women who were bloody well drugged who STILL find it within the shame that can and usually does surround the experience who found a way to blame it on themselves.

It should be possible to find such figures, yes. It is, however, a culture of silence and secrecy. From straight men if raped, because of the cultural framework of what a man should be and how he should react and the subconscious certainty that they have been unmanned by allowing themselves to be raped. For the gay men, if raped... well, the "Asked For It" doctrine is applied to them as easily by fools as it is to women. I've even heard of cases in which the defense of "Well, he's gay, so I figured he'd like it" was used.

Grrr. What humanity is capable of as far as this is concerned sickens me.

[vale797.livejournal.com]

question: In all praticallity, if both women and men are drafted who will stay behind and fuel the engines of industry, farms, and well take care of kids and family?

If this country ever drafts again the reason will be extreme (at least until those that went to Vietnam can no longer vote )

Ultimatly my answer is, as a pacifist, no need to draft cause we should never go to war.

But was curious what your thoughts would be on the industry thing.

Part 1 (because my response went over the limit)

[keisolo.livejournal.com]

*chuckles dryly*

Meh, that is the question, isn't it? I didn't say I thought equality of draft was a good idea. I said that via rights, privelages, responsibilities, etc... being equal, the draft would have to be so, too. But, both culturally, and politically, that sort of total equality is far off, if it is even possible for it to happen. (I won't digress too far into that particular spinoff rant, as it wanders far from the basic issue here of the draft and of war.)

The question you raise is a good one, and one I wonder if anyone "in power" has truly thought about. Even now, with the tactics being used for recruitment, and the process by which the military begins to bring influence to a younger and younger set of minds, we are coming up short as far as what they need to uphold the current war effort.
The impact hasn't been felt thoroughly enough yet, but eventually, the drain being inflicted by this seemingly unending war, will be felt deeply in the industrial sectors. Hopefully, though it is a cynical hope, once big business starts to feel that drain, some of the currently friendly interests to the war will begin to change their tune.

I feel I must have stated myself badly. I do not believe in war for war's sake. I do not believe in war for the sake of business interests or capitalism or oil. I think Vietnam was a mistake, and not because we lost, but because America, of all nations, should be well aware of what happens when a larger power fights a war on someone else's home ground, when it is not truly a savior to a large enough number of the people whose home ground it is fighting upon. This very nation was founded in the smoke of a war where Americans were the little people whose ground was being fought for.

No matter how many times the Bush Administration tries to make a parallel to WWII for Iraq, the true parallel is Vietnam - and the same mistakes are being made - not on a grander scale, per se, but in a far different time. This means that the reactions to it, and to the cost of it, are different, and in many cases, more extreme. One of the most wonderful and most horrible differences faced in this war, as compared to so many of the others that have been fought in this century is the level of medical care available. The VA has been over-run by a need that far outweighs the resources they have access to. We are far more capable now of keeping our soldiers alive. Which I am glad of. Fewer lives spent, being, of course, more positive, especially in the face of an idiotic war effort. But it wasn't thought of, or planned for, and has become another sticking point for those who oppose this war.

What I do believe in, however, as far as conflicts and violence and war are concerned is that there are some battles that MUST, in all conscience, in all humanity, be fought. WWII was that war. Not all the tactics that were used were right, not all the battles that were chosen were the best - but that was a war to stop genocide and world conquest by a man and a political and pseudo-religious viewpoint that would have destroyed much of what is good in humanity in all the arenas in touched. I, myself, probably would not be alive today if America had not gotten involved in that war, and I am not the only one.

Therefore, while I abhor violence, I abhor the fact that there are times when you must say no - this cannot pass - this cannot be allowed to continue - and defend ideals and beliefs and LIFE with something that is the antithesis to most of that which you defend... I am also very firm in the belief that those times do come.

Part 2 (because my response went over the limit)

[keisolo.livejournal.com]

Because of this I cannot be a true pacifist. I wish, on some levels, that I could, because it takes a rare strength to be able to watch the actions that would spur me to action, and hold onto a belief in non-violence. I, however, while I have strengths of my own, do not have that strength. On the small scale, I will respond if someone harms my loved ones, if physical action is required in defense. I will respond and defend myself in a case of rape or other physical harm. On a large scale, there are things that cannot be allowed to happen. Sadly, this country is committing and abetting some of those things with the Iraq war.
I apologize. I know this has covered far more than what you were looking for.

To return to point. I think the draft is, in essence, a ridiculous idea. Service should either be required for ALL who are capable of it, for a period of time (as per the Swiss and the Israeli, if I recall correctly) or it should be volunteer only. But if the draft is to exist, and if women wish equality across the board, the draft (idiotic as it is) should apply to us, too.

Re: Part 2 (because my response went over the limit)

[2eclipse.livejournal.com]

so keisolo, meet vale797 the most fantastic, brilliant, compassionate, sneaky gay priest i know.
who by the way is also a gamer.

vale797, meet keisolo who i just met in the past few months, but who has very quickly come to qualify as a friend in my book due to her thoughtful intelligence, interest in doing things naturally and self-sufficiently, her philosophical questions and in general being a kind and interesting person.

Re: Part 2 (because my response went over the limit)

[keisolo.livejournal.com]

Speaking on brilliance, you just found another way to provoke a grin, and a tip of the hat to you.

Thank you, both for the grin, and the complimentary introduction.

Re: Part 2 (because my response went over the limit)

[2eclipse.livejournal.com]

you are quite welcome. i speak nothing but the truth.
vale797 is a seminary buddy of mine who got me back into larping again....which has been sadly lacking for me lately. i miss the quality of game on the east coast.

Re: Part 2 (because my response went over the limit)

[keisolo.livejournal.com]

I almost envy you having found quality larping anywhere. The entire concept is sort of anathema to me, from what I have seen here. However, I've heard good reports from a variety indicating that it is just this city and LARP that is evil, and that perhaps, someday, I will see something quality... or at least interact with quality people who say they LARP or have LARPED. (Other than my partner or on LJ, that is. Since he is quality people, and so are you.)

[2eclipse.livejournal.com]

you!
i miss you like crazy! when is a good time to call you!

Part 3 (relatively unrelated to 1 & 2)

[keisolo.livejournal.com]

So, due to a particularly interesting, and in my book, fairly stellar introduction... "the most fantastic, brilliant, compassionate, sneaky gay priest i know. who by the way is also a gamer." ...I was thinking of wandering through your LJ.

Originally, this statement was going to go on the first post in your LJ, but you only allow friends-tagged people for that, so I'm asking for permission/opportunity.

Re: Part 3 (relatively unrelated to 1 & 2)

[vale797.livejournal.com]

how can i say no to an introduction like that? you are now added to my friends list

Re: Part 3 (relatively unrelated to 1 & 2)

[keisolo.livejournal.com]

Thank you.

[lucifermourning.livejournal.com]

i don't think the first point is a particularly compelling reason against, as you would still be drafting the same number of people, and leaving the same number behind to do everything. just that more of them would be men.

would probably need exemptions for single parents and regulations to prevent more than one parent in a couple from going to war, but that's about it.

assuming you think the draft is a good idea at all.

[mirage897.livejournal.com]

I thought male rape was rare outside of prison settings.

I am sure there is very significant underreporting

[2eclipse.livejournal.com]

i think it is less common, but i don't think it is all that rare. i even used to know a guy who was raped by a woman (he was drunk and yes, i believe him). i have some female friends who think all men want sex so much that they can be manipulated into sex. frankly, i think force is force, even if the victim is turned on it is still rape.
i'm pretty sure that the "don't ask, don't tell" policy would scare some military guys into keeping quiet for fear of being kicked out for being a victim. disgusting.

[clare-dragonfly.livejournal.com]

Reminds me of something I read in high school for some debate thing... it was about the arguments for and against gays in the military. (I hate using "gay" as a noun but for some reason it's the only thing that works in that sentence...) And one of the arguments against was that supervisors would take advantage and stuff. I'm like "um... doesn't that happen to women too?" And yes, of course it does.

I suspect if there was more equality (in numbers and everything else) this wouldn't happen nearly so often. And if more women were in power there would be a much better system in place for sexual assault help.

[keisolo.livejournal.com]

True.
But, as in many settings, it is really hard for women to advance in the military. It happens, but the culture within the authority structures there is quite a bit behind that of the civilian world as far as male/female equality goes. Which is sort of sad, given that it isn't always that lovely in the civilian either.
Mmm. And I'm shutting that thought train off before it turns into a rant.